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Year 16 Day 59 3:33
Eshaar Gnor

I have recently dropped this character (needed a change), now my question relates to the timing of some things with relation to re-creation.

Firstly is it possible to use my new approved handle before the 3 week timer runs out? The reason I ask this is the three weeks is the perfect time to talk to prospective employers/factions about joining them. It would seem that to do so under this characters name is somewhat wrong due to the separation rules, also I would rather not establish a connection between this character & my new one.

Secondly whist I can't spawn until the three weeks is up (& that BTW is a huge drawback for many returning to the game if they were killed. Bad for player retention. But that is another argument) is there a way I can add custom images to my pool, such as NPC pics etc. I ask because the three weeks is a long wait & I would like to keep myself connected to the game & the process.

Lastly, I think that it is rather imperative that the FULL rules & procedures for recreation need to written & posted clearly so that hose in this situation are aware of what to expect. The past time I did this was perhaps 8 years ago so I can't remember exactly what happens as a veteran member of this game that is less disturbing for me then it would be for a less experienced member.

Year 16 Day 59 4:05
1) You cannot use your new handle until the timer is up (and it has been approved).

2) I could be mistaken, but I do not think that custom images carry over to new characters. I wouldn't risk the CPs without an answer from the asims or art team.

3) The process is outlined in the rules, though that looks a little dated... The first paragraph states that you can select a new handle after three weeks, but the current implementation allows you to submit new handles for approval during your three week timer.

During the "death wait", the only Darkness abilities available will be to view CPs and send DMs

- Straight Forward Rules


Year 16 Day 59 6:30
Unless I am greatly mistaken, your CP image pool is connected to your account, not your character. Admittedly nobody has really asked that, but it would be an absolute waste if someone were to use the same images as their past life & had to re-upload them. I'll check with Sel and Kendall codewise tonight.

Year 16 Day 59 8:51
"Unless I am greatly mistaken, your CP image pool is connected to your account, not your character."

That is correct, I have customs from previous char.

Year 16 Day 59 10:04
Kendall Holm

They are account bassed


Year 16 Day 59 12:43
Eshaar Gnor

I would hope that the images are attached to the account & not the character but that is not the question I asked. The question relates to my ability to add more images to that pool whilst I wait for the 3 weeks to tick by. It would seem that I have no access to exchanging CPs at all. I understand why I can't spawn ships vehicles & such as I am not in the game & where would they spawn, however I should be able to submit images for approval. That should include submitting a request for a custom NPC so that the name & image is accepted & the NPC would then spawn when & where I do.

The reason I am asking these things is to boost player retention during this rather long wait time. I knew what I was doing when I dropped this character I understood the delay (even if I personally think it is a huge penalty & disincentive to stay with the game if you die) but surely if we are convinced that this wait is reasonable then we should look at way to keep the player interested in returning to the game?

The other issue with using the new character name in forums etc., prior to spawning, why can we not do that? As I have said it is a good way for the returning player & their new character to connect with the game & discuss their possible employment whilst they wait. At present if you wish to do this you are forced to do so in your dead characters name which is rather contrary to the separation rule between dead & new characters.

Year 16 Day 59 13:17
Lan Artemis Morbus

Secondly whist I can't spawn until the three weeks is up (& that BTW is a huge drawback for many returning to the game if they were killed. Bad for player retention. But that is another argument)... 

Just want to point out that it's 3 weeks from the moment they were killed, not 3 weeks from when they logged back in. So this isn't a drawback for those returning to the game since, odds are, they'll be able to respawn immediately upon returning to the game.


Year 16 Day 59 21:11
You can't use the name yet because it isn't actually your permanent name until you create a character. Until the wait is up you can submit new names to replace a name you had accepted if you decide you would rather use something else. We aren't going to lock people into a name until they create their character. It's a deliberate choice for the system to function like this and causes far fewer problems than the requests to change name for 3 weeks would.



Year 16 Day 59 22:55
Eshaar Gnor

Lan: Seriously? As I said it is an argument for another time & place but did you not get that I was referring to an active player returning from death be it deliberate or otherwise not an inactive player returning to find themselves long dead & clearly past the 3 week wait? Anyway a mute point & off topic somewhat.

Syn: I can understand it from that point of view & for many it is perfectly valid. But would a compromise therefore be allowing a player to create their character thereby locking in the name but not spawn or activate (no access to inventory etc.) their character until the 3 weeks expires? I mean that would resolve all the points I am raising in that you would be posting under the new name & presumably being an "alive" character, albeit not yet spawned or active, would allow you access to adding custom images & posting under your new name.

Perhaps it might be an option for those players like myself who have already worked out exactly what they want as far as a character design. I mean if your character is created but not spawned or activated, therefore not active in the database as such the effect is the same as the present system in so far as waiting 3 weeks, but the player can again be active in communications.

Year 16 Day 59 23:11
Lan Artemis Morbus

I wasn't making an argument. I was stating a fact. And in your initial post you said "returning to the game." An active player returning from the dead isn't the same as returning to the game.


Year 16 Day 60 2:04
Rather defeats the entire point of the death wait for a new character to already be created and be capable of IC communication and participation before it's up.



Year 16 Day 60 3:28
Eshaar Gnor

I thought that the "point" behind the recreation time delay is to prevent people turning up in a future war quickly after their death? Or similar such events, not in effect to prevent the player from restarting the game & maintaining their interest in the community?

Perhaps I am wrong? Perhaps this is a deliberate attempt to prevent the player from interacting with the community & starting to develop their new character & his/her relationships with the community for three pointless & otherwise meaningless weeks? What exactly is the real point of this delay & why is it deemed so important to the game that its obvious negative effects on player retention are negated by its benefits?

Don't get me wrong in my case I chose to do this & I know the wait time even if I find it completely counterproductive to the game as a whole. What I would like to know is what exactly is the point & why is it held in higher regard than player retention? If I recall correctly there was recently a forum started by one of the Admin team if I recall correctly seeking to gain some ideas on how we could retain players? Well removing this otherwise meaningless & quite silly requirement is perhaps one method? Perhaps it is not so important now, but what happens when combat is released in a completed format with player deaths possible? We could potentially see many. many deaths & some of those people will not return, some because they do not want to start again but some more will not want to wait & may well find an alternative game to play in that three weeks which might just prove to be a more entertaining game with less such delays & we will loose them to this community.

So what is the point of this time delay? Why is it deemed more relevant than player retention?

Edited By: Eshaar Gnor on Year 16 Day 60 3:29
Year 16 Day 60 5:54
One point that I had heard in the past was that the three-week timer helped prevent people respawning until they became FS. Though I don't know if this is still as applicable with the changes, it was at least one reason.

Generally I think the inconvenience to those who are "killed" or choose to drop is balanced by the need for (what Jevon mentioned) and those who make throwaway characters to be dissuaded somewhat from continuing to play with the OOC/IC separation line. I don't agree that player retention would be significantly increased by eliminating or mitigating that inconvenience, and the mitigation would just reduce the dissuasive power of the timer.

In order to prevent worse problems, sometimes the Good have to suffer. Airport lines, e.g..

Year 16 Day 60 10:01
Yes, it discourages people from respawning for FS at a low level, and it discourages people from scamming and dropping to clean the slate and doing it over again, which is sadly common. It is a multipurpose addition that serves primarily to make death meaningful rather than encouraging people to use death as a strategy for metagaming.

Considering that the death wait does not affect the vast majority of people at all, it is certainly not among the primary reasons for player retention issues. The people who aren't retained in over 90% of cases haven't even died yet. Trying to directly correlate the two is simply not accurate.



Year 16 Day 60 12:34
Eshaar Gnor

I understand the desire to stop those that are abusing a system such as those that re-create simply to pursue force sensitivity & those that might aim to obtain a clean slate. But is that not as easily prevented by human intervention as multi accounts are? Would it not simply be easy to monitor the regularity of re-spawning of those you do this?

I never said it would be a huge retention solver NOW or in the future, but that it may will be a significant one later with the introduction of death in combat, when I would say we will see a lot more characters facing death & therefore players facing this delay.

Why do we always have to take the lowest common denominator approach? Why do those of us who have played the game for more than 12 years & will only be creating their 4th character the last having a good reputation & being almost a grand master in the force be penalised because some seek to abuse the game? If there was no way to prevent the things you have raised other than a recreation delay then I would wholeheartedly support it, but there is so this it is a rather inappropriate way because it penalises those good & honest players who happen to get killed or who simply chose to play a different game after many years with the one character.

Is there not a better way to achieve the aims of preventing the continual re-spawning to achieve force sensitivity? As for re-spawning to cleans ones trading slate, I think that is unachievable as those with the inclination to play such a childish game will do so regardless of any delays.

Year 16 Day 60 13:01
But is that not as easily prevented by human intervention as multi accounts are? Would it not simply be easy to monitor the regularity of re-spawning of those you do this? 

No, it has always been very difficult to track, which is why there were never many bans or punishments for perpetual respawners for FS even though it was declared illegal ages ago. It is simply too difficult to monitor and prove, even with ten times the limited manpower we have available, so deterrents are the best solution.

If for some reason this becomes a significant retention issue in the post combat distant future, it can, of course, be revisited. But killing people will not be so simple as many people seem to believe, so it is far too soon to complain about hypotheticals already.

You chose to respawn knowing there was a 21 day delay. A feature that exists for a reason isn't just going be rewritten for you because you don't like the outcome or don't agree with the reasons. From a logistical and administrative standpoint the delay is without question the optimal solution at this time.



Year 16 Day 60 22:51
Eshaar Gnor

Please do not presume that I am complaining out of a purely personal dislike for the current system. As I clearly said at the start I was & am aware of the present rules & never assumed that I would be able to have them reduced for myself. As with any comments or suggestions I have ever or for that matter will ever make they are because I foresee an issue for the game as a whole.

I am & always have been one of those people who raises issues selflessly & have raised a few that would in fact disadvantage me, but I saw them as an issue for the game as a whole. Anyway now that you have explained things more completely I can understand the present desire for this ruling, I still think it is disappointing that those of us who play this game in the spirit it is intended have to have such penalties unintentionally include us.

Either way is their a method or possible fix that would allow a person like myself to assume the new character name for all of the interaction reasons I have stated before prior to the expiry of the 3 weeks? I think that this is a simple compromise & if you add a warning that this change is permanent etc., etc., as you do with skill points then it covers you as far as you can. It also still penalises those simply trying to become FS & create a clean slate, as they are not in the games database as a character & can't be tested until spawned, whilst allowing those legitimate players to re-enter the community (albeit only in a communicative sense) as soon as possible.

Year 16 Day 61 1:46

So selfless

Year 16 Day 61 2:47
No, nothing like that exists. If you want to try to persuade the developers to spend time on it, that's what the Suggestions forum is for.



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